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crlovescakes
Junior Member
Joined: Oct 01, 2007
Posts: 63
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 Posted:
Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:08 pm |
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So I have been trying to figure out and set up my pricing system for the last 2 hours tonight. I have my price per serving but now I have no idea what chart to follow for the number of servings for each cake size. How do you guys do it? Do you charge different for a wedding cake vs. a party cake? For example...
Party (1.5x2x4)
10"x4" Round = 24 servings x $1.50/serving = $36.00
Wedding (1x2x4)
10"x4" Round = 38 servings x $1.50/serving = $57.00
I do not want to charge more for a wedding cake because it is a wedding cake. I would like all my price per serving to be the same, I am just not sure if the above is what I should follow?
Any advice would be lovely! |
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smbegg
Forum Addict
Joined: Sep 09, 2005
Posts: 936
Location: Plano, TX
Birthday: Dec 14
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Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:18 pm |
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You have to do what you feel is best. I price off of the party size no matter what type of cake. Most people do not know that there is even a difference in size options.
Stephanie |
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kelleym
Official CakeBoss Rep
Joined: Aug 24, 2005
Posts: 2551
Birthday: Dec 21
Gallery Supporter Member
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Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:26 pm |
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I do not recommend having two sizes and two prices. You are setting yourself up for confusion and LOT of questions from brides about why their "wedding" cake is more expensive for smaller pieces. I have one serving size, and my price per serving varies only by whether it is a one-tiered cake ($2.00/serving) or 2+ tiers ($3.00+). That way a four-tiered birthday cake is priced the same as a four tiered wedding cake. |
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indydebi
Forum SuperStar!
Joined: Jul 07, 2006
Posts: 15009
Location: Indianapolis IN
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Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:27 pm |
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They can call it a wedding cake, a birthday cake, a kiss-my-butt-at-8th-and-Main cake ..... the price is the same.
I use the Wilton wedding chart. (1) you get more money for a cake. (2) 90% of my business is weddings, so it's logical.
And I don't go into a big schpeel about ".... it's a 10" round, and it's designed to serve X servings, times $XX a serving = the price". A client calls and says "I need a cake to serve 25 people. An 8" serves 24 ... a 10" serves 35. So I tell them, "You'll need a 10" round and the price is blah blah. A 10" round will serve 25-35, depending on how you cut it."
They are welcome to cut the pieces of cake any dang size they want..... they can cut a 10" cake in half if they want and serve it with 2 forks to two people ... but they are paying for the number of pieces the cake is DESIGNED to serve.
If you decide to go by party sizes, it would seem logical to me that your price per serving computation be higher than what mine would be .... since you are figuring in more cake per serving (bigger pieces = bigger per serving price) than I am.
And you're not charging more for a wedding cake "because it's a wedding cake". You're charging more because they can be more work and more time.
My wedding cakes are delivered .... sheet cakes are not. My wedding cakes have the cost of a free sampling .... birthday cakes do not. Wedding cakes require special engineering and construction knowledge and expertise....a single 2-layer cake does not.
"So, Debi....if you have all of these differences, then why are 10" round cakes the same price?" Good question, Grasshopper!  Because I am not going to put myself in the position of explaining to a client why her 10" round wedding cake for a reception for 25 cost more than her neighbor's 10" round birthday cake for a party for 25.
By pricing them both the same, I have the option of discounting if the mood hits me. LIke, for example, I had a customer order a 10" round cake and they lived about a 70-minute drive away .... almost 1.5 hours round trip to pick up a cake. I discounted them $30 since they were picking it up instead of having it delivered. They happily paid me $75 for a 10" round cake that they drove 90 minutes to get.
The key to consistent pricing is to pick a chart and stick with it. YOu are using the chart to determine pricing, not necessarily to determine number of serving, even tho' these two numbers coincidentally happen to be pretty close to the same. |
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CakeDiva73
Forum SuperStar!
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Joined: Jan 30, 2006
Posts: 2488
Gallery Supporter Member
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Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:18 pm |
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Well cr*p Debi....just when I think I have it all figured out. I am going to lose my mind. |
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CakeDiva73
Forum SuperStar!
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Joined: Jan 30, 2006
Posts: 2488
Gallery Supporter Member
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Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:18 pm |
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crlovescakes
Junior Member
Joined: Oct 01, 2007
Posts: 63
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Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:30 pm |
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Sooooooo.... Long!!!!!! Sorry!
Thanks for the input. However, I think I am even more confused then before!
I am all for using one chart and sticking with it! I am also all for using one price no matter the type of cake.
The part that confuses me is if I charge $1.50/serving (and stick to that as a pricing guide) maybe add for fondant or gum paste decorations etc. The wilton wedding chart says that an 8" square cake makes 32 servings, so that would mean that I charge $1.50/serving = $48 (Sorry to revert back to the ... x ... = ..., but that is the only way I can figure to keep it consistant). Anyway, it just seems to me that I know my customers would look at a 8" square cake (not very big mind you) and say wow! Not much for $48+tax huh? (most people do not know what actually goes into baking and decorating a cake, they only think about the $'s.
The reason I mentioned the 8" cake above is that I am doing a 8" gift box cake covered with chocolate fondant and a hot pink bow on top. I only charged $45 for this. Somewhere I found a chart that said an 8" square feeds 20 so I charged according to that number. Now if I used the Wilton chart I should have charged $80 for this cake! Am I crazy or is that similar to what you charge. Granted different areas can demand different prices of course.
My whole point to this thing is that I would just love to put a speadsheet together so I can say if I do a 6-10-12-16" cake is will be this many servings and will equal this dollar amount. With that I can add other misc. expenses or fees. Maybe this is impossible because a wedding size piece of cake will always be smaller then a birthday cake piece? At least in my house we tend to eat large pieces of cake then 1x2!
Maybe I need to do more research in town to see how others charge around my area, but how does one do that without blowing your cover? (A whole other topic here!) |
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crlovescakes
Junior Member
Joined: Oct 01, 2007
Posts: 63
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Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:47 am |
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jkalman
Forum SuperStar!
Joined: Mar 12, 2007
Posts: 4198
Location: Southern New Hampshire
Birthday: Oct 28
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Tue Mar 18, 2008 6:32 am |
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Yes.. if they want an 8" square cake.. I charge $4/serving.. an 8" square serves 30.. that's $120. Add fondant and that price goes up another $30.
You have to stop looking at it as an 8" cake for $120.. it's dessert for 30 people for $4/head.
If anything.. your party slices should cost MORE than your wedding slices.. they are afterall 50% bigger than a wedding slice. So if you have an 8" square.. you charge $2/serving wedding you should charge $3/serving party.. see what I am saying? |
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jkalman
Forum SuperStar!
Joined: Mar 12, 2007
Posts: 4198
Location: Southern New Hampshire
Birthday: Oct 28
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Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:01 am |
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I'll take your 8" box cake and break it down the way I see it.. how I would think about the cost breakdown.. using your $45.00.
One recipe of cake.. $8.00
1/2 recipe of frosting.. $5.00
1/2 recipe of filling.. I'll say $3.00 but it varies depending on what you make
1/2 recipe of chocolate fondant.. $3.00
Gumpaste for bow.. $1.00
Add that up.. That's $20.00 before you even start to calculate profit.. that leaves $25 for your profit.. subtract for gas for getting the ingredients.. the electric for running the stove and the water to make and clean up.. you are talking no more than $20.. that cake took you how long? Think mixing and baking, making frosting, and fillings.. that's 1.5 hours.. leveling and filling.. that's another 30 minutes or so.. frosting and covering in fondant.. another 45 minutes to an hour.. making the bow.. 20 minutes.. cleaning your kitchen.. another 30 minutes if your lucky.. That's 3.5 hours roughly.. divide your profit by 3.5 and you are making a bit over $5/hour.. that's less than the dishwasher at your favorite restaurant makes.. and you are hand crafting a beautiful centerpiece dessert. It takes eral skill.. and time.. and you should be compensated for that time.
I would charge $150 for that cake.. 150 minus the 30 for materials and utilities.. my profit is $120.. divide that by 3.5 and my hourly wage is $34.. And I really think if you added it all up it'd take more than 3.5 hours. $5/hour is not worth it to me to take time away from my family.. but $30/hour I can more easily justify that. |
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crlovescakes
Junior Member
Joined: Oct 01, 2007
Posts: 63
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Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:34 am |
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jkalman-
Thanks for doing all that figuring! I guess I did know that I make about $.50/hour with how I am charging in my area.
That 8" cake in particular started out as a 2-tierd gift box cake with a 7-6" cakes and I think I quoted something like $65. My customer came back and asked if I could scale down and make just a one tier cake for closer to $50. Therefore, I came up with just the 8" cake serving 20 @ $2.50/serving for fondant. Then I tacked on a 10% first time order discount making it $45 + tax.
I think I am fine with my pricing, I do think I am in the same range as the local bakers in this area for buttercream at least. I am not sure how much fondant work they all do?
My question still remains unanswered though. What serving chart should I use? I would like to go with one chart for wedding and party cakes. But that would mean that the wedding cakes are going to be huge pieces or the party cakes will be small pieces? I really want to avoid charging different for a 10" round wedding tier then for a 10" round party cake. |
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kelleym
Official CakeBoss Rep
Joined: Aug 24, 2005
Posts: 2551
Birthday: Dec 21
Gallery Supporter Member
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Tue Mar 18, 2008 9:20 am |
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You should use whatever chart you want to use. No one can tell you what you "should" use.  Caterers are trained to cut wedding cakes to Wilton's chart, which is 1x2x4. If you are planning on mostly weddings, that's probably what I would recommend. I use Earlene's chart for everything, and it is roughly 1x2.5x4. I do a lot of showers, parties, etc, and I am extremely comfortable with Earlene's sizing, ie: I really think an 8" cake gives 15 pieces, and would not feel comfortable telling anyone they could get 24 out of it.
Earlene's chart:
http://www.earlenescakes.com/ckserchart.htm
Wilton's wedding chart:
http://www.wilton.com/wedding/.....kedata.cfm
I can't locate Wilton's party chart at the moment (help, JanH!  ) but if memory serves, it has similar but slightly larger slices than Earlene's. |
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jkalman
Forum SuperStar!
Joined: Mar 12, 2007
Posts: 4198
Location: Southern New Hampshire
Birthday: Oct 28
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| Posted:
Tue Mar 18, 2008 9:27 am |
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jkalman
Forum SuperStar!
Joined: Mar 12, 2007
Posts: 4198
Location: Southern New Hampshire
Birthday: Oct 28
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Tue Mar 18, 2008 9:32 am |
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Looking at that.. this is basically the chart I use.. I just round off for even numbers because I hate uneven numbers..  .
round
6" - 10
8" - 20
10" - 30
12" - 50
14" - 70
square
6" - 15
8" - 30
10" - 50
12" - 70
14" - 100 |
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crlovescakes
Junior Member
Joined: Oct 01, 2007
Posts: 63
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Tue Mar 18, 2008 9:34 am |
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Thanks for all the good advice! I have been sort of using Earlene's Cake Chart already, I think I would feel comfortable sticking to that chart!
Thanks Again! |
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